Securicar/thief advantage/disadvantage, and small suggestions to balance it

[Konali]

Current situation:
Positive things for thiefs(hijackers)

   
• Thief is allowed to use all types of cars, advantage with speed and health(cop cars)
• Thief is allowed to camp unload spots, advantage cause an unload takes about 7 seconds.
• Limited(4) unload spots for securicar missions> advantage due to limited unload places
• Thiefs are able to locate loaded securicars, and guess where they are heading to, due to the limited unload spots its easy to guess wich unload you should choose to camp.
• The unload spots for hijackers are many,  due to the fact it guides you to one of the nearest unload places, its pretty doable to deliver an armored van to a close hideout.
• pushing an empty car in the unload to block it, eventhough its not allowed, its always to late for the securicar driver once this has been done. Its hard for staff to proof the thief actually placed the car in the unload marker.

Negative things for thiefs(hijackers)

   
• Armored van has shitty health+ shitty handling> easier to get arrested due to a combination of these facts
• Possibility to get blocked by convoy mates
• not possible to  /fix the car, they have to get out to /fixcar it by taking a risk to get arrested for it. Part of point 1 of the negative things
• not able to choose their mission, they have to depend on luck/timing/skills and police in the area.
• Able to fuck a mission of another player, where there is to less guarentee your own mission will succeed in the first place.

6 Positive things for thiefs/5 negative = +1

Positive things for securicar drivers

   
• police escorts, but they are useless against unload campers due to the fact the police cant do anything there.
• money payout got also some sort of risico factor in it, normal van missions pay less.
• able to /fix the car and fuel it up without much risk
• able to select their load/drop off, thiefs cant

Negative things for securicar drivers

   
• Police escorts are only usefull while driving, at unloads against campers its limited.
• Easy to take over @ unloads/tolls etc.
• Empty cars pushed into the unloads by thiefs.
• only 4 drop off points for securicar missions, SF isnt even able to unload at.
• limited options to check who is a  thief or a regular player
• Able to fuck a mission of another player, where there is to less guarentee your own mission will succeed in the first place.

4 positive things for securicar drivers 6 negative = -2

Staff side:

   
• - Alot of reports about one of these mission types.
• - Alot of questions about rules/exceptions and so on
• - staff doing one of those missions cant really spec without getting robbed when they get back unspecced.
• -/+ players are happy about new types, but on the other hand confuzed about regulations and limitations

So thats how i see things after i have done all types of mission and staff duty things that are related to these new types.

I think these things would be fair minor updates:

- Atleast 2 bank unload spots in the big cities (now= LV- 1/LS- 1/SF- 0)and 1 in the smaller cities( AP/fort carson/bayside/sandus/vci) Result= thiefs are able to steal/camp different load spots thus the chance that cops are camping one crucial load spot as it is now will be less, and for securicar drivers the chance that you can unload is bigger.
Simply because, unloading takes about 7 seconds, where a thief is allowed to camp it would be harder for thiefs to take abuse of this absurd long unloading time if there where more unloads.

   
• - Not every load is hijackable(is that a word?)= not every load you start with is able to be hijacked, lets say for example: from the 3 missions you can choose, only 2 are hijackable.

   
• - /thiefs = since thiefs have the big advantage to plan a heist, and i dont think its needed to make thiefs visible on the radar, /thiefs will do Not only for securicar drivers, but also for staff. Imagine a report, and doing /thief would solve a situation really quick to see who of the rammers is allowed to ram, and be rammed.

   
• - Its really hard for thiefs NOW, to unload a securicar( besides LV), because its broken, or due to the limited unload spots. If you are not camping the LV bank, LV has 3 unloads for thiefs or sth, so instead of starting with 2 wanted stars, maybe 1 star would do?

Konali out

[Matheus]

Agreed

[F4LL]

Agreed

[IcePick]

Agreed

[Benny]

I Agree too.
I think that Thiefs could /fix but they cannot steal ur car while u'r "UNLOADING".
And the securicar need's to get more healt like a cop car or more i mean it is an armored van not a normal car.

[Jedi]

Positive things for securicar drivers

   
• police escorts, but they are useless against unload campers due to the fact the police cant do anything there

Negative things for securicar drivers

   
• Police escorts are only usefull while driving, at unloads against campers its limited.

You are wrong here in both sentences.

Police escorts is fucking usefull for van drivers since they can ramm thieves for defend them. Plus, you're wrong since if a thief which make wreck a van and hijack it, or hijack the van in the unload point, since the van is STOPPED and if the cop is near the thief, the cop immediately arrest the thief as soon as the thief get in the van. No possibility for the thief to drive neither 1 meter.

Also I'm against the command /thiefs, this will alert all members of convoy which will call in chat for police needed.

For the rest I agree.

[Konali]

Positive things for securicar drivers

   
• police escorts, but they are useless against unload campers due to the fact the police cant do anything there

Negative things for securicar drivers

   
• Police escorts are only usefull while driving, at unloads against campers its limited.

You are wrong here in both sentences.

Police escorts is fucking usefull for van drivers since they can ramm thieves for defend them. Plus, you're wrong since if a thief which make wreck a van and hijack it, or hijack the van in the unload point, since the van is STOPPED and if the cop is near the thief, the cop immediately arrest the thief as soon as the thief get in the van. No possibility for the thief to drive neither 1 meter.

Also I'm against the command /thiefs, this will alert all members of convoy which will call in chat for police needed.

For the rest I agree.

Hmm ok, but cops are not allowed to ram player on foot that are camping at the unloads. I wish they where, then they can do atleast something.

[Ephraim_Renais]

Armoured convoys can NOT ram thieves to help out friends, Only ram to protect yourself, not your "friends", this is STILL intentional ramming, and not allowed.

Wouldn't this count for those cops escorting armoured cars/convoys, meaning they can't take action against a potential thief?

Remember that you should obey all Server Rules and driving rules even when you are a cop. The only case when you can ram any player is when player is a suspect. If player refuses to pay ticket, you need to wait for him to become wanted before you try to stop him. You must not drive on train tracks or on the wrong side of the road unless it's necessary to catch a suspect.

Said thief is not a suspect until he actually hijacks the load.  Plus cops might not be able to determine if a thief is driving a car that passes him so to ram what could be an innocent player that just happened to be driving by or near the armoured car/convoy is wrong.  Therefore cops should not ram other players period, potential hijacker or not.

[Vado19]

+1 i agree on increasing securicar strength to that of cop cars strength.
+1 i agree to more unload points for securicar drivers (i.e SF)

-1 for thieves camping unload points (i.e blocking unload marker)
-1 thieves being able to hijack moving truck (make it able to be jacked at say 0-3kph)

If truck is stronger it makes it easier for theif to escape with it in at least poor state, this fixes the issue of them blowing up the trucks on attempt to steal.

[RaceRX]

i havent had any bad run ins with the security car missions yet. i wonder why.. oh, wait.

[TheGame]

i totally agree with Vado.

+1 i agree on increasing securicar strength to that of cop cars strength.
+1 i agree to more unload points for securicar drivers (i.e SF)

-1 for thieves camping unload points (i.e blocking unload marker)
-1 thieves being able to hijack moving truck (make it able to be jacked at say 0-3kph)

If truck is stronger it makes it easier for theif to escape with it in at least poor state, this fixes the issue of them blowing up the trucks on attempt to steal.

[Bruno_2MLG4CT]

- Not every load is hijackable(is that a word?)= not every load you start with is able to be hijacked, lets say for example: from the 3 missions you can choose, only 2 are hijackable.

+1 i agree on increasing securicar strength to that of cop cars strength.
+1 i agree to more unload points for securicar drivers (i.e SF)

-1 for thieves camping unload points (i.e blocking unload marker)
-1 thieves being able to hijack moving truck (make it able to be jacked at say 0-3kph)

If truck is stronger it makes it easier for theif to escape with it in at least poor state, this fixes the issue of them blowing up the trucks on attempt to steal.

Yeah, this is everything what we need...

[ThomasKirkman]

One problem I encounted today is thieves ramming the Securicar to jack it, and ramming ANYBODY else in the area. 
As a Cop, while patroling LS, I saw a Van that was under assualt and started to follow so that if/when
it was jacked, I could arrest the thief on the spot.  But I started to get rammed just for being there. 
Rules need to be put into place, or clearly stated, that thieves can't ram everthing around a Securicar just because. 
If Cops are prohibited from doing their job to defend Securicars, then thieves can't ram cops to take
them out of the chase.

ThomasKirkman   

[Konali]

One problem I encounted today is thieves ramming the Securicar to jack it, and ramming ANYBODY else in the area. 
As a Cop, while patroling LS, I saw a Van that was under assualt and started to follow so that if/when
it was jacked, I could arrest the thief on the spot.  But I started to get rammed just for being there. 
Rules need to be put into place, or clearly stated, that thieves can't ram everthing around a Securicar just because. 
If Cops are prohibited from doing their job to defend Securicars, then thieves can't ram cops to take
them out of the chase.

ThomasKirkman   

I fully understand you, and saw similair cases in the past days. But look this this big risk mick took with adding heist missions:


Bringing a feature in the game, where the server was based on hostile behaviour and no deathmatching at all, is risky. Allowing a group to ram players takes time to get used to. I personally think the robbing securicars part has 2 points : 1= its realistic and challenging, 2= its the opposite world of what we had. Where only authority(cops against suspects) was allwowed to ram, we now have Al Qaeda [/size]behavior on the server.
[/size]
[/size]I tried to name all the advantages and disadvantages from these 2 things. I dont see issues with house robbing and trash. Securicar and heist missions are a risky step, because you not only fuck up missions of other players, but there comes also a ramm everything on sight attitude along with it.

[/size]Maybe you guys have excellent simple solutions. I tried, thats all i could do

[Strato]

To the 1st point with hijackers, add another -1, the car can be broken down when You try to rob it... which will be 6 positive, 6 negative = 0

[Smurf]

People are letting the securicar blow up to dont be hijacked.

And worst, they are doing /q too. We should have a rule for that.

Like when a thief is near to the a loaded securicar and the trucker do /q, he get automatically arrested...

[Gameboy]

Agreed

[$nake]

Agreed with kona

[Shock]

1st. Make security cars stronger
2nd. Shorten the time that takes to unload a security van
3rd. allow the police to protect the vans at anytime ( at unload points to )
4th. make some sort of command that truckers who are driving a security van can see who is a theft or not
5th. make more unload points for security missions( that way thefts wont be able to hijack every time while camping )
6th. make some rules about thefts ramming every vehicle while trying to hijack a van

I think that will do it

[Smurf]

1st. Make security cars stronger +1
2nd. Shorten the time that takes to unload a security van -1
3rd. allow the police to protect the vans at anytime ( at unload points to ) They already can. they cant ram the thief if he isnt a sus.
4th. make some sort of command that truckers who are driving a security van can see who is a theft or not +1 (but i think it's better: a command /thiefs that securicar truckers can use. and the thiefs will appear in the radar with a different color for a fez seconds.)
5th. make more unload points for security missions( that way thefts wont be able to hijack every time while camping ) +1
6th. make some rules about thefts ramming every vehicle while trying to hijack a van They have to be careful. they can't ram any another vehicle...

[Vinny]

People are letting the securicar blow up to dont be hijacked.

And worst, they are doing /q too. We should have a rule for that.

Like when a thief is near to the a loaded securicar and the trucker do /q, he get automatically arrested...

The problem is you can't stop a player from doing /q, there is no script possible ...

[bazingashane0]

+1 i agree on increasing securicar strength to that of cop cars strength.
+1 i agree to more unload points for securicar drivers (i.e SF)

-1 for thieves camping unload points (i.e blocking unload marker)
-1 thieves being able to hijack moving truck (make it able to be jacked at say 0-3kph)

If truck is stronger it makes it easier for theif to escape with it in at least poor state, this fixes the issue of them blowing up the trucks on attempt to steal.

1st. Make security cars stronger
2nd. Shorten the time that takes to unload a security van
3rd. allow the police to protect the vans at anytime ( at unload points to )
4th. make some sort of command that truckers who are driving a security van can see who is a theft or not
5th. make more unload points for security missions( that way thefts wont be able to hijack every time while camping )
6th. make some rules about thefts ramming every vehicle while trying to hijack a van

I think that will do it

With both of these I see a lot of advantages people doing the securicar missions (transporting them) but what if any advantages are for the thief's ? So far all people are giving a shit about is making sure they get the securicar achievement so they get a higher interest increase.

[[IT]Vercingetorige]

i agree with Konali but i would change 3 things

- no unloading time or at least minor unloading time (2 - 3 sec)
- cop are allowed to ask for fines but when a securicar's driver is mission he had not to pay fines until he unloaded, in this way when he finished the mission he do /pay within 30 sec as for other player, this to prevent a cop ask for fines while a securicar is beeing attached
- no police escort allowed for securicar

[[TLC]Titanio]

i agree with Konali but i would change 3 things

- no unloading time or at least minor unloading time (2 - 3 sec)
- cop are allowed to ask for fines but when a securicar's driver is mission he had not to pay fines until he unloaded, in this way when he finished the mission he do /pay within 30 sec as for other player, this to prevent a cop ask for fines while a securicar is beeing attached
- no police escort allowed for securicar

+1

I have other ideas, since we are speaking of reinforced vehicles, they still have the armored locks, then it would not be possible to pick locks in few seconds, especially unloading places.

[Shock]

- no police escort allowed for securicar

they arent such a halp anyway, i aggre on that

[[IT]Vercingetorige]

to avoid thieves a frined asked to the Vercingetorige's Dumper to give him a lift!

those are result:



since i asked joshy to restore an empty car leaved by a thief in the unloading point and he answered that nowehere is written in the main server rules that this is not allowed i decide to use a little trick:

i don't think this is against rules.... because what is not explicitily written as forbidden should be considered as ALLOWED

now TRY TO STOP HIM!!!!!

[Ethan]

FUCKING CODES DONT FUCKING WORK GOD DAMNIT

[Calvingreen17.]

-1 thieves being able to hijack moving truck (make it able to be jacked at say 0-3kph)

No. this should be a +1. Because almost EVERYTIME when you get the securicar right where you want it, and the player drives off while you're hijacking, it's BACK to the car to chase the securicar that is probably already at it's unload.